The Julian Assange thriller

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The Julian Assange thriller

Postby LittleBabyNothing » Fri Aug 17, 2012 7:07 am

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-19292323

Ok, since there's no topic on this and it seems that this will turn into a real nightmare real soon, time to have a topic on it ;-)

So, since when is the UK extraditing people who haven't been charged with anything?!?!
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Re: The Julian Assange thriller

Postby Zappanalé » Fri Aug 17, 2012 10:44 am

Well, the European Arrest Warrent does list four offences he's wanted in connection to, which is still lawful ground to extradite him.
 
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Re: The Julian Assange thriller

Postby LittleBabyNothing » Fri Aug 17, 2012 11:23 am

“Why can’t I try on different lives, like dresses, to see which fits best and is more becoming?” - Sylvia Plath.
 
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Re: The Julian Assange thriller

Postby Zappanalé » Fri Aug 17, 2012 4:43 pm

Not at all. The arrest warrant is for extradition to sweden, which is subject to the same guarantees as the UK, but the US isn't.

The precedent is from the case of Soering.

There's much more guarantee of due process and other rights being protected in Sweden than in the US. So we'll extradite to Sweden, but not the US, when you're dealing in a case where there's a risk of rights being violated.
 
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Re: The Julian Assange thriller

Postby EaP » Fri Aug 17, 2012 7:19 pm

The Julian Assange Thriller...

oh yes, its a beauty isnt it? and all played out before our very eyes 8-)

i said in the news today thread some time ago that i believe mr assange is a dead man walking, and i still believe that

he has sorely provoked the USA, the most powerful (and the most spiteful and vengeful when they have the mind) nation in the world

they have a vast military and intelligence capacity and no-one is immune when they set their mind to it. Bin Laden showed that

i have no sympathy for him. he was arrogant and stupidly egotistical to think he could do what he did with no come backs

got to wonder what the Ecuadorians think they're playing at though. it can't end well for them either :lol:
 
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Re: The Julian Assange thriller

Postby Belle Leisha » Fri Aug 17, 2012 8:09 pm

If he was killed, people would know he'd hit a nerve and with good reason, it would vindicate him. Every possible attempt has and will be made to discredit him, I'd be amazed if it went any further, despite lunatics like Sarah Palin calling for his execution.

He was arrogant, yes. If arrogance was grounds for execution it would become very quiet around here. ;)
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Re: The Julian Assange thriller

Postby Zappanalé » Fri Aug 17, 2012 8:38 pm

Are we still insisting this conspiracy of the US putting pressure on Sweden/UK in order to extradite him?

You know, if Assange does face anything remotely like the death penalty, neither country could extrad-I've already said this, I'm amazed it didn't sink in.
 
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Re: The Julian Assange thriller

Postby Belle Leisha » Fri Aug 17, 2012 8:51 pm

Zappanalé wrote:Are we still insisting this conspiracy of the US putting pressure on Sweden/UK in order to extradite him?



No, commenting on the numbers of Americans who want him killed and how dumb of them if would be.
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Re: The Julian Assange thriller

Postby P.T » Fri Aug 17, 2012 8:59 pm

Zappanalé wrote:Are we still insisting this conspiracy of the US putting pressure on Sweden/UK in order to extradite him?

You know, if Assange does face anything remotely like the death penalty, neither country could extrad-I've already said this, I'm amazed it didn't sink in.


I wouldn't be surprised if after he turns himself in, he just...disappears.

Also, of course there is a conspiracy. The sexual offences charges are fabricated. I'm assuming you'd need evidence to give grounds for extradition/arrest and with a rape that might have occurred a long time ago, there isn't going to be any. Only testimony. Perhaps from someone who's been paid a large amount or works for the secret services/government who would be immune from arrest for lying in court. Perhaps people in other situations would go through with this trial to 'clear their name', to 'regain their honour', but that's clearly not necessary.

I think all bases are covered there.
 
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Re: The Julian Assange thriller

Postby EaP » Fri Aug 17, 2012 10:40 pm

Belle Leisha wrote:If he was killed, people would know he'd hit a nerve and with good reason, it would vindicate him

my point is that regardless of what people know, the USA could and maybe will kill him with impunity

vindication is no good to a dead man

does he have a wife and children, has he given them no thought?
 
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Re: The Julian Assange thriller

Postby Belle Leisha » Fri Aug 17, 2012 11:04 pm

EaP wrote:
Belle Leisha wrote:If he was killed, people would know he'd hit a nerve and with good reason, it would vindicate him

my point is that regardless of what people know, the USA could and maybe will kill him with impunity

vindication is no good to a dead man

does he have a wife and children, has he given them no thought?


I'm not suggesting it would be okay for him, I'm saying the USA wouldn't do it, because it would worsen the 'damage' done by him. I think it's extremely unlikely the USA would plot an elaborate assassination from afar, while the law is just being followed here and in Sweden. Either way though, to kill him would be stupid. Everyone who has said he should be killed, are just mental reactionaries.

I don't know if he has a family, but he really isn't the point. He was one of many involved with Wikileaks and all they did was make information and documentation publicly available. It was dumb of him to let his profile get so big but compared to the idea he's this big a deal, because of wikileaks, he's not up there on the scale of stupidity.
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Re: The Julian Assange thriller

Postby Lino » Fri Aug 17, 2012 11:51 pm

that rape in Sweden case is very strange, I believe it's some bulshit from the CIA (they're able to do it and much more) to just wipe him out of this land.
Good one on Assange for showing the hypocrisies that go on in these cables and on Equador for their help.
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Re: The Julian Assange thriller

Postby Kes » Sat Aug 18, 2012 3:41 am

It's not all that simple.

Do you believe there's any justification for a country to hold state secrets, in any circumstances?

If you feel there isn't, then Assange is part of the machine that makes the world a more open place.

But in feeling that way, then your world really has no place for organisations like the FBI, CIA, MI5/MI6.

The unfortunate facts are that whatever society you feel is an ideal one, someone else, somewhere, will believe it is anything but. Once you decide there is any justification for your society to protect it's interests against others, from international espionage, right through to counter-terrorism, then people like Assange effectively become traitors to your beliefs that your government has a right to protect you from whatever it feels is exploiting, or trying to exploit it's national interests.

Where do you draw the line?

Hacking is hacking. The whole idea of finding a back door into someone's private information is what it's all about. From someone's bank details and personal profile, all the way through what Assange done, to the War Games scenario.

Back to where you draw the line. ANY lines at all, and you have something that WILL ultimately be moved to suit the purpose. It's a bit like tabloid journalism in principle. Are you allowed to have a private life?
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Re: The Julian Assange thriller

Postby Zappanalé » Sat Aug 18, 2012 11:39 am

Also, of course there is a conspiracy. The sexual offences charges are fabricated.

You do know it's not cool just to claim a fabrication and leave it at that, right?
I'm assuming you'd need evidence to give grounds for extradition/arrest and with a rape that might have occurred a long time ago, there isn't going to be any. Only testimony.

No, if there's a reasonable suspicion that the crime happened, that's sufficient for an arrest pending investigation.
Perhaps from someone who's been paid a large amount or works for the secret services/government who would be immune from arrest for lying in court.


And perhaps the Queen is a Lizard.
 
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Re: The Julian Assange thriller

Postby P.T » Sat Aug 18, 2012 12:24 pm

Zappanalé wrote:
Also, of course there is a conspiracy. The sexual offences charges are fabricated.

You do know it's not cool just to claim a fabrication and leave it at that, right?
I'm assuming you'd need evidence to give grounds for extradition/arrest and with a rape that might have occurred a long time ago, there isn't going to be any. Only testimony.

No, if there's a reasonable suspicion that the crime happened, that's sufficient for an arrest pending investigation.
Perhaps from someone who's been paid a large amount or works for the secret services/government who would be immune from arrest for lying in court.


And perhaps the Queen is a Lizard.


I didn't 'leave it at that', I proved that it happens to be something that you don't necessarily need physical evidence for, just some lass saying "Ohhhh this guy raped me!" If they'd have fabricated a murder charge, they'd have needed a weapon and a body. For example.

She is, didn't you know?

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