The Great War 1914-1918.

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The Great War 1914-1918.

Postby JLP » Mon Aug 04, 2014 9:23 pm

One hundred years ago tonight, Great Britain declared war on Germany. Thus began the most terrible conflict in human history. As I watch some of the programmes commemorating the start of the war I feel very humble as I hear the stories and words of soldiers from both sides. We should remember them for ever to ensure we never repeat the madness that began on August 4th 1914.
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Re: The Great War 1914-1918.

Postby icy » Mon Aug 04, 2014 9:43 pm

We do remember as we should.
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Re: The Great War 1914-1918.

Postby Tarkus » Tue Aug 05, 2014 6:33 am

Have we really learned that much?

The end of WW1 saw the partition of the Ottoman Empire into the middle Eastern countries we see today, and caused all the fall out with Islamist fundamentalism we see today.

The war was used as an opportunity by the Bolsheviks to start their revolution, causing 80 years of communism and the alienation of the Russian states that still goes on to this day, despite the collapse of the Soviet union over two decades ago.

The allied nations inflicted punitive costs on Germany to foot the bill of the war, caused the breakdown of the Weimar republic, which paved the way for the Nazis to rise to power, which in turn drove the Jews out of Europe to seek their old home in Palestine, which in turn led to the creation of Israel, and the fomentation of hatred for the western world from every Arab state ever since.

Because of all this, we have Iraq and Afghanistan now invaded and occupied to counter Islamist terrorism, the threat of a new caliphate under Isis replacing the Ottoman empire that would be more brutal and harsh than the old one, and perpetual war in Gaza that seems never to end.

All of this happened as a result of Gavrillo Princip assassinating Franz Ferdinand, who ironically was in the process of instigating reforms in Europe that Princip would have agreed with and supported, had he known.

The modern world we know was shaped, for good and ill, by a war that was essentially a ghastly mistake. I don't doubt that 'our boys' went out there believing that they were doing their bit to stop German imperialist expansion, but our country and its' monarchy wasn't under any real threat, so to say that they fought for our freedom and democracy is incorrect, and an addition by modern propaganda to help justify our military actions abroad nowadays- to give our modern actions a kind of nobility by association.

It's my honest opinion that if any of them were to see what's happened to the world now, and what we're doing with their legacy, they'd be ashamed of us for still being at war, when they wanted all wars to end by 1918. By all means, we should remember their sacrifice, but I really think we should work towards world peace and make their sacrifice something truly worthwhile.
 
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Re: The Great War 1914-1918.

Postby Kes » Tue Aug 05, 2014 12:41 pm

The thing is, by remembering the absurd waste of human life at events like the Somme, we can hope that we avoid doing the same things again.

I'm not too sure you can blame the First World War for it's sequel. After all, half of WWII came about, depending on your perspective, because America was economically squeezing Japan. It's "cause and effect", and we could still have got from exactly the same A to B, by a different route. What happened happened.

As an incidental, one of my grandfathers, was in the trenches in what he called The Great War. I remember having quite in depth chats with him about those times, even though he was in his seventies, and I was only about five or six. He later found out, that in the trenches in the exact area he was placed, opposite him, was a German bloke who was also a corporal, and that guy went on to change his name to Adolf Hitler, and try to take over the Western world.

I also remember my grandfather showing me a big scar going most of the way up his left arm. That was put there by a German bayonet, he told me. Unfortunately for the German on the other end of that bayonet, he was himself on the end of my the one my grandfather had secured on the end of his rifle. He didn't come out of it quite so well.

Four f*cking years that went on, the lines to and fro-ing, never really moving more than a couple of miles in over three years of constant death and bodies piling up. One of the interesting stories to come out of it were the tunnel rats, a group of miners on each side who'd dig underneath the enemy's positions, and plant literally tons of explosives, wiping out hundreds in a single event, and creating ma-hoosive craters, many which can still be seen from the air nearly a hundred years later.
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Re: The Great War 1914-1918.

Postby Elessar » Tue Aug 05, 2014 2:51 pm

So what did Adolf Hitler change his name from?

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Re: The Great War 1914-1918.

Postby JLP » Tue Aug 05, 2014 3:13 pm

I have no idea what my ancestors did in the Great War. I know my maternal grandfather died in 1940 whilst serving for the merchant navy. Pretty sure his vessel was torpedoed by a u boat.
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Re: The Great War 1914-1918.

Postby Kes » Tue Aug 05, 2014 3:37 pm

Elessar wrote:So what did Adolf Hitler change his name from?

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My grandfather ALWAYS called him Corporal Schicklgruber when he referred to him, so maybe it was a "being there" sort of joke on his part, who am I to say. Hitler's father Alois apparently changed his name to Hitler, or technically Heidler.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alois_Hitler
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Re: The Great War 1914-1918.

Postby Elessar » Tue Aug 05, 2014 3:46 pm

You don't get many Adolfs these days, do you?
 
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Re: The Great War 1914-1918.

Postby Kes » Tue Aug 05, 2014 4:10 pm

Not really.

You don't seem to get too many Schicklgrubers to the pound, either.
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Re: The Great War 1914-1918.

Postby icy » Tue Aug 05, 2014 5:35 pm

JLP wrote:I have no idea what my ancestors did in the Great War. I know my maternal grandfather died in 1940 whilst serving for the merchant navy. Pretty sure his vessel was torpedoed by a u boat.

Can you track the records down?
I did that a few years ago. I always knew my Great Grandfather died in the war, just didn't know how.
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Rags are blowing
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I'm done with running
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~Sleep in peace old friend for me you'll never die~
 
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Re: The Great War 1914-1918.

Postby Lino » Tue Aug 05, 2014 9:35 pm

Well, we never learned with war. 2 world wars, Korea, Cold War, Middle East Wars, Vietnam and the one Portugal went through in the former african colonies (Angola, Guinea, Mozambique at the same time). Europe had the Balkans' war in the 90s, now Ukraine. Afghanistan...
Always wars for geo-political reasons, people always suffer and die, and we never learned.
Portugal sent troops to La Lys in 1918. Germany killed 7500 of our men in 4h on that day, such a tragedy.
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Re: The Great War 1914-1918.

Postby action » Wed Aug 06, 2014 11:35 am

people always say "we" didnt learn from the war, but "we" never wanted the first two world wars in the first place. it's rather "we" were called to duty by the establishment, and the powerfull elite who wanted to extent their economic power. the elite in france, britain, germany,... ALL wanted to maintain their wealth and extent it even more.

italy stayed out of the war the longest due to a strong socialist opposition, but as time went on they had to bent for the constant calls from the economical elite, that war means business, and business means money.

to this end, they used millions and millions of innocent people who were brainwashed by nationalist propaganda to the point they wanted the war too. and if propaganda didnt help to convince working class men to fight, they were forced to or punished as deserters.

"we" didnt have to learn anything. its the fucking economic elite that should, and so far they havent learned a damn, they have only further damaged our world with wars and environmental disasters
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Re: The Great War 1914-1918.

Postby action » Wed Aug 06, 2014 11:46 am

even the so called "civil wars" in the middle east are financed by the establsihment. isnt not like some cavemen with an ideology magically can own tons of advanced weapons. wars are started and maintained by no one else but the rich elite who have the knowledge and money to produce weapons on a large scale and deliver them to whom they see fit.
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Re: The Great War 1914-1918.

Postby Kes » Wed Aug 06, 2014 12:54 pm

magic action wrote:people always say "we" didnt learn from the war, but "we" never wanted the first two world wars in the first place. it's rather "we" were called to duty by the establishment, and the powerfull elite who wanted to extent their economic power. the elite in france, britain, germany,... ALL wanted to maintain their wealth and extent it even more.

italy stayed out of the war the longest due to a strong socialist opposition, but as time went on they had to bent for the constant calls from the economical elite, that war means business, and business means money.



A good theory, except that WWII financially crippled evey nation that got involved in it.

The only country that really made a shedload out of it was Switzerland, due to 5 million Jews (and a few thousand Germans a couple of years later) stashing their money there, never to reclaim it.
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Re: The Great War 1914-1918.

Postby JLP » Thu Aug 07, 2014 12:25 am

I deleted all the edited posts. For once can we please respect what this thread is meant to represent. If not, i would rather delete it.
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