what created the multiverse?

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what created the multiverse?

Postby action » Fri Oct 16, 2015 7:03 pm

our universe is like a giant balloon, a confined region of space of unbelievable size.

there are many such balloons however, and scientists now believe our universe is part of a "multiverse"

our universe started with the big bang. it began with an infinitely small space, which generated all the matter we see today. it is suspected the big bang was a "white hole", as opposed to a black hole. rather than sucking matter up, it spit matter out.

this matter came from another universe. could our universe create other universes? our universe has many black holes. they suck matter up. black holes can become so heavy they can actually puncture through the fabric of space, and creating a "white hole" on the other side of the universe, or a new big bang.

this is all well and good, but what created the space, in which all the universe float? what created the multiverse?

the very fact that the multiverse exists, defies all logic. why is there "space"? what is "space"? where did it all began?

if we know where it all began, what was before it? "something" must have set the process in motion to create "space". at one point in time, "space" was created. before space, there was no space. there was nothing, not even emptiness.

if there was nothing, not even emptiness, not a single neutron of energy, how the fuck could something go on creating space?

whatever created space must be a being of unbelievable, insanely, terrifying powers. the very thought of something that is able to create everything, is so far beyond logic and understanding it terrifies me through my very bones.

why did it made life possible in our universe? the whole universe and everything it is made of, has such delicate laws of nature in just the right balance, it necessarily leads to life. life is the universe's goal. but life ends on earth, so what was it all for? the whole universe is made to create life, but at the end of life is death. it's a giant machine, that is inherently flawed; the life it creates will cease to exist. and if all energy in our universe is gone, no further life will be created. the whole universe will have been an effort of cosmical irrelevance.

so there must be more to life than we understand. the life after life. maybe the universe itself, with all its delicate laws, points to only one conclusion, that there is something after life. life has to have a meaning, a purpose for this mysterious, unknown being.

if this being can create a universe, in order to create life so it can then harvest this "life", one can question why did this being needs the whole trip down to the universe's history? why doesnt it just create life, in stead of creating universes? why doesnt it create a pizza, in stead of creating a pizzeria first? it can create a pizzeria so surely it can create a pizza just of its own? why was a universe needed? why were multiple universes needed? was one not enough?

but above all: where the hell did space come from? why isnt there just nothingness, not just emptiness, but even less than emptiness: nothing?
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Re: what created the multiverse?

Postby The__KingOfRhye » Fri Oct 16, 2015 8:16 pm

Image

:P
 
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Re: what created the multiverse?

Postby YAFF » Fri Oct 16, 2015 9:14 pm

action wrote:our universe is like a giant balloon, a confined region of space of unbelievable size.

there are many such balloons however, and scientists now believe our universe is part of a "multiverse"


What outdated book are you reading? What scientists? A small minority "believe" it while many simply theorize. There's not one scintilla of proof a "multiverse" even exists. It was/is one attempt in many to get around the fact (some say "problem") of THE universe and time itself beginning to exist at the "big bang". Because of metaphysical implications of a beginning there are no shortages of theories but that's a good thing, actually. It so far has shored up the one theory that has makes sense of the actual evidence we have.

Nevertheless, you are correct that a multiverse does not truly obviate the need for "something". One cannot really say "before" since time began at the singularity. There had to be, logically, (because the universe and time began + an infinite regression of events is impossible) one "something" that exists without beginning or conditions for it's existing.
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Re: what created the multiverse?

Postby Elessar » Fri Oct 16, 2015 11:34 pm

I hate to say it, but YAFF's right. The multiverse theory is still a bit of a fringe theory, although it has become more popular in recent years.

Trivia: One of the early proponents of the multiverse theory was The Eels' dad.
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Re: what created the multiverse?

Postby YAFF » Fri Oct 16, 2015 11:44 pm

[quote="Elessar"]I hate to say it, but YAFF's right. [/quote]

Good one :lol:
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Re: what created the multiverse?

Postby The__KingOfRhye » Fri Oct 16, 2015 11:52 pm

There is the "many worlds interpretation of quantum mechanics", which basically states that everything that could have happened did happen, and by doing so created another universe, so there's an infinite number of universes.

Weird stuff, but then again quantum mechanics is some pretty weird stuff itself...
 
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Re: what created the multiverse?

Postby YAFF » Sat Oct 17, 2015 12:09 am

The__KingOfRhye wrote:There is the "many worlds interpretation of quantum mechanics", which basically states that everything that could have happened did happen, and by doing so created another universe, so there's an infinite number of universes.

Weird stuff, but then again quantum mechanics is some pretty weird stuff itself...


Not only weird but by all evidence pure fiction. Thus far there is copious evidence for the "big bang theory", which means the universe and time came into existence from an initial singularity. Once. Until and if actual evidence is discovered that contradicts what we know and/or points in another direction all "weird" universe theories should be referenced with extreme caution ;)

The reason the "many worlds" hypothesis is so intriguing is it makes any and everything possible. Life is a rare occurrence? So what? With an infinity everything that can happen will eventually happen. The hypothesis does away with an absolute beginning.
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Re: what created the multiverse?

Postby Elessar » Sat Oct 17, 2015 12:43 am

The many worlds theory has some weird consequences if true.
For example, every time you die, that particular world ends for you, so the only world you can remain consciously aware of is one in which you survive. This means that eventually there'll only be one world left for you, and that's the one in which you somehow manage to live forever. The other consequence of that is that for every world in which you die, there'll surely be more worlds in which you don't die but are horribly injured or disfigured. That's a nice thought.

Then there's quantum Russian roulette. The idea is that you can never lose, because the world you will be aware of will be the one in which you survive. Even if you fire all 6 chambers, you'll live in the world where the loaded chamber locked. I guess this also means it's impossibly to kill yourself, which is also possibly a fairy unpleasant thought.
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Re: what created the multiverse?

Postby julymorning » Sat Oct 17, 2015 3:18 am

Don't laugh, just seeing the topic I thought this about multi-tracking on Queen albums. :lol:

The thought of not having a conscious thought anymore has plagued me my entire life. I have always been very much up in my brain, as I suppose everyone is, and the idea that it all ceases to exist just boggles me.
The idea that death is like sleeping falls short for me. Because in my sleep I dream, I feel, I hear-enough to be awakened very easily.

i used to entertain the idea of moving on to another reality upon death. Now, I don't. And I believe that these theories are made up of men (or women) that were also looking for something other than nothingness.

Did anyone think they'd found a shred of evidence to support these multiverse theories?
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This is probably as good as it gets.

      
 
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Re: what created the multiverse?

Postby The__KingOfRhye » Sat Oct 17, 2015 4:01 am

julymorning wrote:Did anyone think they'd found a shred of evidence to support these multiverse theories?


Well, for that 'many-worlds interpretation' I was talking about at least, it's not even a thing you could probably prove or disprove. More like an explanation to try some make some sense out of how when you get down to the sub-atomic level, things get really weird ...
 
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Re: what created the multiverse?

Postby Elessar » Sat Oct 17, 2015 4:12 am

One attractive feature of the multiverse theory is that it explains why the universe is able to support life, when small changes in the laws of physics would make it impossible.
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Re: what created the multiverse?

Postby action » Sat Oct 17, 2015 3:04 pm

what created "space"?

i'm not talking about what created the big bang. what created space itself?

how can the space, in which everything we know is, exist?

where did the creator of space exist? does the creator exist in space or in something else? but how can it be something else? what else is there, but space??
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Re: what created the multiverse?

Postby fairydandy » Sat Oct 17, 2015 3:34 pm

action wrote:what created "space"?

i'm not talking about what created the big bang. what created space itself?

how can the space, in which everything we know is, exist?

where did the creator of space exist? does the creator exist in space or in something else? but how can it be something else? what else is there, but space??


Is it that difficult to imagine nothing? If there was a power cut the world over, there would be no internet, nothing, emptiness, all gone...but you wouldn't look for a 'space'. Power back on and there it is... :P

I don't know, none of us do. I guess, as little more than monkey's we got lucky, but not quite lucky enough to understand it....'yet'. :?
 
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Re: what created the multiverse?

Postby action » Sat Oct 17, 2015 4:38 pm

fairydandy wrote:
action wrote:what created "space"?

i'm not talking about what created the big bang. what created space itself?

how can the space, in which everything we know is, exist?

where did the creator of space exist? does the creator exist in space or in something else? but how can it be something else? what else is there, but space??


Is it that difficult to imagine nothing? If there was a power cut the world over, there would be no internet, nothing, emptiness, all gone...but you wouldn't look for a 'space'. Power back on and there it is... :P

I don't know, none of us do. I guess, as little more than monkey's we got lucky, but not quite lucky enough to understand it....'yet'. :?


it's not difficult to imagine "nothing". in fact, "nothing" is the only logical thing to happen.

but there is not "nothing". there is three dimensional space. the fact that there is space, where you can go left, right, forward, back, boggles the mind.

why isnt there just "nothing"? who created this?
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Re: what created the multiverse?

Postby The__KingOfRhye » Sat Oct 17, 2015 6:56 pm

Elessar wrote:One attractive feature of the multiverse theory is that it explains why the universe is able to support life, when small changes in the laws of physics would make it impossible.


"I cannot change the laws of physics, Cap'n!" :P

There's an argument I always liked, called the 'weak anthropic principle', which basically means, of course the universe is able to support life and it seems fine-tuned for us, if it wasn't, we wouldn't be here to talk about it.
 
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